Debian 9 released!
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Offline OrvilleG

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Debian 9 released!
« on: June 18, 2017, 12:35:18 AM »
https://www.debian.org/News/2017/20170617

"After 26 months of development the Debian project is proud to present its new stable version 9 (code name Stretch), which will be supported for the next 5 years thanks to the combined work of the Debian Security team and of the Debian Long Term Support team.

Debian 9 is dedicated to the project's founder Ian Murdock, who passed away on 28 December 2015."

Offline DQSII

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Re: Debian 9 released!
« Reply #1 on: June 18, 2017, 08:40:14 AM »
Yep i wiped my osx lion on my 2007 mac pro for debian 9 and have arch linux on my main core i3 pc :)

Offline OrvilleG

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Re: Debian 9 released!
« Reply #2 on: June 18, 2017, 08:55:35 AM »
I upgraded from Jessie last night, went really smooth

Offline Kalthrix

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Re: Debian 9 released!
« Reply #3 on: June 20, 2017, 02:38:56 AM »
Awesome! Going to have to give it a try. :)

Offline edge226

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Re: Debian 9 released!
« Reply #4 on: June 20, 2017, 04:49:04 PM »
Too bad this did not happen before I switched distros. I tried out debian and the stable version was just too old. Now I don't feel like trying the setup of it again.

Offline OrvilleG

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Re: Debian 9 released!
« Reply #5 on: June 20, 2017, 08:37:50 PM »
No Python 3.6 :(

Guess i'll still use 2.7

Offline DQSII

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Re: Debian 9 released!
« Reply #6 on: June 22, 2017, 01:58:41 AM »
Personally debian is a great distro but i prefer arch over debian personally

Offline CwF

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Re: Debian 9 released!
« Reply #7 on: June 25, 2017, 11:58:38 AM »
Yah!   I launched into linux about a year ago and landed on debian as THE foundational distro of all distros. That's my vote. I changed my repo to 'stretch' back in February at the freeze and it's been pretty smooth since then.Well, qemu/kvm on Debian actually since I still use XP heavily, mostly offline.
I had a conversation with an IT guy recently. He said 'Why debian???? You should look into Docker!" I felt the immediate need to exit the conversation as simply and quickly as possible....

Offline edge226

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Re: Re: Debian 9 released!
« Reply #8 on: June 27, 2017, 01:11:48 AM »
I had a conversation with an IT guy recently. He said 'Why debian???? You should look into Docker!" I felt the immediate need to exit the conversation as simply and quickly as possible....

That IT guy knew a thing or two... I tried Debian before 9 was released and landed on Ubuntu of all things recently. Surprised the heck out of me but I need a stable OS where I can do/get everything I need.

Debian was too old to get everything I needed at the time, Maybe not on 9 but I've already got a decently setup system at this point.

Docker allows me to test whether the things I make are portable or not on different Linux systems if I choose to use it in that way.

It can create an entirely deployable system, Ensuring that the environment is setup correctly and the user does not need to modify it for the tools to be used. This can be done in a dockerfile script used in auto building images.

It can encapsulate your processes if you choose to do so, I'm going to be using this to run commands from a chat bot in a docker instance with no network then sprunge the results and provide a Linux tutorial in my chat bot. This instance has PID limit controls so it cannot be forkbombed and exploited.

When combined with a Continuous Integration system it allows me to build all of my websites out of markdown on the fly whenever I push markdown to the git repository.

When combined with my distro framework it will automatically build my linux distro when that part is completed...

So... its up to you to decide whether Docker can be useful. It only makes my life about 1000% better. Learn about the application and implementation of the technology before you just write it off.

Oh and developing with Docker just has a side effect... Everything I build is cross-platform because Docker is cross-platform.

I develop a Linux framework and its actually easier to test it on W10 because its easier to setup docker on that platform. Sad but true these days.

Offline CwF

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Re: Debian 9 released!
« Reply #9 on: June 27, 2017, 01:30:58 PM »
edge226, you are absolutely right, and I assure you you're grasp of these things is far beyond mine. The IT guy does know, but is narrowed in his purpose and missed my narrower one, now does, thinks it's interesting, and of limited mass market appeal = I agree. But, I'm on a different path.
 First, as a mechanic on non-consumer non-street/highway machines I have a heavy interest in preserving obsolete methods of diagnosis and firmware programming. Things you may literally need out of production pieces not only to move forward, but simply maintain. This always requires specific hardware configurations. This means paravirtualization as the possibility. Previously I'd mention a pmcia interface..good luck on that! To my knowledge, hardware passthrough is not a docker feature, and if it is would be a major stumbling block to portability. I understand docker to be entirely software based, possibly answering similar problems. I take debian with qemu/kvm as the most viable foundation moving forward since so far it does the best job at reaching back in time with modern hardware.
 Second, I'm more interested in an architecture like Qubes OS as a method of rolling up many requirements into a single machine, while fully exploiting modern core counts and memory capacity. With Docker I have a bias perhaps that is has a bloated nature and simply duplicates and compartmentalizes code again and again, each with specific tweaks for induvidual packages of purpose to be singular and portable. One could argue that fully exploits cheap storage, I'd silently agree, but to me it's still massive duplication of code, bloat.
 Third is just that, bloat and duplication. I've worked hard to reduce to a common code base without needless duplication. While not so conducive to a rolling release model, I run a single base core that is read only with a package of programs on a few read only layers on top of that, then run-time rw layers representing each VM on top of that. So I don't know what the footprint of a docker image is to do a specific job, but I have VM's with <100MB footprint. Not exactly portable on a specific purpose level, but I can spit out an image to an ssd in minutes that will then boot some other computer in the functional form needed, like to a toughbook with a removable drive and the ports required. Also, theoretically, without specific knowledge of the architecture the base layers of the system are isolated, dare I say impervious to attack. With a tiny net install image and a 2.2 GB pool the system is reproducible off-line. Add to that a 1.4GB truly portable image of XP, that can also make an installable image.
 So, docker for sure has a bright future. But for serial and parallel and omg pcmia equipment, no future at all, but I'll try to offer a bridge to the obsolete. The last tough book I built could talk to Bombardier, polaris, cummins, cat, and normal obd...that's an odd machine. I could imagine a breakout box and a single usb to a laptop, tablet or even a phone, with a docker like package to do these things, it's just not here yet

Offline edge226

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Re: Debian 9 released!
« Reply #10 on: June 27, 2017, 02:18:59 PM »
Pretty sure you could just share a device file and you just shared hardware access within docker. VM's are way heavier than Docker so if low footprint is your desire then docker is your thing. Docker can even be used in conjunction with a VM. Docker does not serve all purposes and perhaps your purpose is better suited VM's, If only due to familiarity.
I can say setting up custom environments is far easier in Docker than it is in a VM.
I can have a Dockerfile that does all the setup for an image... I'm probably going to be creating a new docker image for a server based programming software I found out about a couple days ago.
They don't have a docker version and you know what that is no big deal, Because I can spin up my own dockerfile very easily. You just simply tell the docker file what image to start with and start installing what you need, Tell it a command to run on launch and you're pretty much G2G.

Offline CwF

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Re: Debian 9 released!
« Reply #11 on: June 27, 2017, 04:50:33 PM »
I took a quick look, yes docker fulfills much. Without knowing before hand, much of my thinking has been along the lines of dockers structure, I thought "we'll I'll be" as I read. It is more than my conversations led me to believe, but at the end of the thought the scope of docker is really a subset, a non-opensource one at that, of qemu/kvm. Virtual box is also in that category but closer in scope. I mention VB because I did test, as of 5.2 it was close... The part docker misses according to what I was just reading is  the port passthrough needs to be perfect and pass to an OS that runs the obsolete software. The software will never be rewritten, especially when the original market size is tiny, and smaller now. And hence the XP VM requirement, can reach into the DOS days.
 I'm more interested now on the input drivers, mouse can still cause issues, and the advancement of QXL acceleration.

And on subject, the release of Stretch has leapfrogged pretty far forward. It's not hopelessly outdated like many have claimed. I'm on a current kernel with functional and current desktop. My first Debian was way behind Xubuntu 16.04 and is now much better. I discontinued 'buntu's. I have no desire to chase arch even though it is force of development overall. Not before, but now I think Debian9 is enough for the modern desktop user. XFCE has a ways to go on the other hand, but I use that.